WANT to know what I don’t get?
Okay, first, preamble as per always. I haven’t written anything for a few weeks. Here, that is. Tons of other stuff but nothing footbally, nothing here. Nothing since Jürgen Klopp got the job. Two reasons for that:
1.) All the other stuff. Takes time, you know. All that staring at a blank screen trying to come up with some kind of clever? Time consuming.
2.) All the Jürgen stuff. I mean, seriously? Have you read it? Like, all of it? It’s incredible. There’s been some amazing stuff written prior to his arrival, on what his potential arrival would mean in terms of the pulling power that the club still has, and post his arrival on what he can actually do with those lads on the pitch. Tons of stuff, brilliantly written, brilliant to read.
On here, that is. Sure there were other people writing stuff, but here’s the stuff that matters. Genuinely nothing that I could add, no new angle, no fresh insight. Everybody had it nailed down perfectly. And they all felt the same way I did or, given their words were out there, I felt the same way they did. Basically we all – all of us, every one of us, total unanimity among the fan-base on this one – had fallen in love with Jürgen Klopp.
I love his attitude to just about everything, love the laugh he throws out there when something genuinely amuses him, love the fact he threw out that ‘normal one’ line with a shrug that said: “I’m taking the piss out of you here lads, I’m giving you a line because I know you want a line, if you use it you’re basically a bunch of knobheads” and then watched them use it.
I love the fact he bollocked every photographer in the room for being rude when a journalist was asking her question. I love the fact I was slightly shocked when he moved from speaking pretty damn fluent English into answering a question in German. The German shouldn’t really have surprised me, what with it being his actual language, but it did.
I love the fact the madness of the first press conference gave way to absolute common sense very quickly. Impressed with the fact that he wanted people to stop asking for photos with him in restaurants and bars because he didn’t want the whole world thinking he was spending all his time in restaurants and bars. I love every single appearance he’s made, hang on his every word. I’m willing to watch him sit and listen in the post Rubin Kazan presser as somebody translates his answers into Russian. I might be obsessed but we all are; that’s why I’d nothing new to add. We all know all this stuff.
I’m happy with the Spurs game. 0-0 away after what they did to City when he’s only had three days with the team and suddenly we’re pressing higher and faster and with more energy. We look goosed after 25 minutes, look like we desperately need these double sessions at Melwood to get as fit as he wants us, but can see that it will come. I’m happy with the Spurs game.
And this is where we come to the crux of things, the “want to know what I don’t get?” bit.
I’m happy with the Rubin Kazan game. Genuinely happy. No problem with it at all. Only managed a draw against a ten-man team who are sitting 12th in their (not overly stunning) league? Yeah, fair enough, that ten man thing can be more issue than assist most of the time, we know that. A million shots but very few on target? Fair enough. Not ideal, obviously, but I’ll take it at the moment. Would I have taken it under Brendan? No, but Brendan wasn’t in the middle of changing things after a week’s worth of training. Not changing things in the right way anyway – tons of changing but nothing changed, if you get my drift.
I sat in the main stand last Thursday night and I saw lots of good things. I saw an organised defence that stood its ground pretty damn well. I saw Mamadou Sakho carve his name into legend letter by letter with every take, with every pass. I saw Martin Skrtel do good things. I saw Alberto Moreno and Nathaniel Clyne pick up the ball and run. I saw Emre Can basically be Emre Can all over the place.
Emre. There’s something to talk about. I bumped into Mr Roberts of this parish at the Ride gig last week (he’s quite fond of them apparently) and we had a chat afterwards about Emre. One of us (and I’m not saying who) said this would be Emre’s chance in midfield, the other thought he wouldn’t be up to the task as his speed of recovery isn’t up to it, that he can’t turn quickly enough for a Klopp team. The first conceded this was the case, but that the lad was clearly well thought of in Germany. The second took this point, but couldn’t see it translating into the Premier League. Emre seems aware of this doubt. Emre’s doing everything to counter these doubts. Emre’s doing everything and looking smart.
James Milner, I’m not sure about. He’s going to work hard, he’s going to redefine ‘workhorse’ but I’m not entirely sure what he actually does. Not sure what he gives to the team. Certainly not corners. Think he needs to be looking at Jordan Henderson. I know there’s loads that disagree on this one but not as many as disagree on the next one.
Joe Allen was good against Kazan. He was. He genuinely bloody was. Worked well as the pivot, burst through men on a couple of occasions, won aerial duels. Joe Allen WON AERIAL DUELS. You see that coming? No, me neither. Joe Allen was good in the first half. Lucas was better in the second, but that still doesn’t alter the whole ‘Joe Allen Was Good’ argument. Adam Lallana was excellent. Again. He’s basically being Adam Lallana but at speed, with some bollocks and he’s turning into a proper little nark as well. I like that.
Philippe Coutinho’s struggling but that’s okay, Roberto Firmino’s being reintroduced and he showed well in his European 20 minutes. Wanted the ball, popped it round, talked to midfielders. Favourite moment was the one where he clearly told Milner: “Give it to me and I’ll give it to him”, while pointing at Can and then did it perfectly, all in less time than it takes to describe. And that turn? That turn? Jesus. The lad’s got something, it’ll happen.
Divock Origi toiled, worked hard, threw some nice turns in. If we can find him a killer instinct then we’re laughing. Christian Benteke’s being reintroduced and no, it didn’t quite happen for him against the Russian lads but there’s that movement for the chest down about 30 seconds after he comes on, there’s the space he makes on the left to pop that shot in that hits the post. On another night….
And Big Si Mignolet makes another cracking save.
Yeah, we get caught with Clyne being on the wrong side of the Rubin lad for the goal (and I’m still not convinced the free kick that starts the passage of play WAS a free kick) but that can be remedied, he’s not doing that again. And yeah, there were too many hopeful crosses low into the box and high into the box, but next week there’ll be a lad there who meets those things and he’ll have been back from six weeks out for more than 30 seconds.
So, there was no cutting edge but there was movement and zip and one-touch passing and an intent to move forward at all times. And that’s what I thought as I left Anfield. Pretty much okay about the whole thing on the whole. The result may have felt like a Rodgers result but the performance was far from it. The performance kept going all the way to the end. Never stopped, never gave up, looked to create all the time. I’m having that.
And then I turned Twitter on and realised we were actually shite. Clearly deluded in my belief I’d watched a pretty okay game of football where all that was needed was a cutting edge that would come with time with the new boss, it appeared what I’d actually witnessed was evidence that the malaise was far deeper than we had thought. It was evidence this was a very poor squad and that Jürgen was in for a much rougher time than any of us had thought, that the rebuilding job was immense.
I’d like to apologise to all of Twitter now for quite enjoying the game – if not the result, which I was merely OKAY with – last night. I’d also like to thank them for putting me right and for their sterling efforts in tempering everybody’s optimism. Equally, I’d like to thank all those in the ground who started screaming at Coutinho the second he misplaced his first pass to Can. It’s a good job those guys are there to point out the ball was shit, as he wouldn’t have realised otherwise. He might have laboured under the misapprehension that he and Emre have only played in that particular combination a couple of times and that perhaps they don’t know each other’s preferred runs yet. He may have thought: “Next game, I’ll know he wants it three yards that way and then we’re laughing”. Possibly in Portuguese that last bit. Thank God people were willing to put him right and let him know he’d fucked up, that’ll help the lad sort it out.
You’d hope we’d develop a bit of patience on this one, wouldn’t you? We realise Brendan Rodgers was sacked because it was going wrong and we needed someone to put it right. We know we appointed the single best candidate for the whole ‘putting it right’ job in ALL OF WORLD FOOTBALL. And it hasn’t all become the 1988 team in the first three hours of football, so we’re throwing the doom and gloom all over social media, we’re criticising loose passes from the stands.
It may not have been a masterclass but it wasn’t the worst day of my life. A bloke that knows more about football than I do said that.
Southampton. Three days later. The Thursday to the Sunday? I never get the Thursday to Sunday argument. Between Thursday and Sunday there’s a Friday and a Saturday, between Wednesday and Saturday there’s a Thursday and a Friday. The names change, the maths doesn’t. Maybe it’s years spent in retail going: “There are seven days in a week, the only difference is the names”, but I’m not having the: “Oooh, playing Thursday then Sunday is harder than Wednesday then Sunday” bollocks. Simply not having it. The game though, the game. The first half’s dreadful. The first half’s dreadful to an: “If Brendan was in charge we’d be booing these lads off at half time again” level. You know how dreadful the first half is, you’ve seen it, you may have commented on it. We’ll get to comments in a minute.
Second half though? Benteke comes on and does more in the first two minutes than Origi does in the entire first half. Fades for quite a while after that but does more in those first two minutes than Origi does in his 45. Might be something to with the fact the lads behind him are more willing to hit him with a ball he can do something with. Might be something to do with the fact his movement is so much better than Origi’s, that he actually gives those lads a target to aim for. Might be a combination of the two. Might be something to do with the fact Origi is 19 and learning his trade while Benteke isn’t, and isn’t. We’ll come back to Origi in a second, for the moment let’s just say big Chris (I feel i can call him that)’s header is bloody gorgeous and deserves to win games.
So, we’re playing well, pretty much, and we’re pushing and we’re trying and then we score and then our heads fall off again. It’s not the moment when Southampton equalise that knocks our heads off, it’s the moment when we score ourselves. We score, we lose our heads, the pattern’s self-fulfilling at the moment. The players become anxious, the stands become anxious, the players feel the anxiety in the stands and become more anxious. Anxiety is all, equaliser’s inevitable.
The boss has said it, we’re not calm, we don’t defend the free kick calmly. The free kick. I’m blaming the free kick. We had this conversation last night; I’m blaming the free kick – the act of conceding it – others will blame the defending. The free kick is, it can be rightly argued, 40 yards from goal; there’s a lot of defending that can be done between point A and point B. It feels ungracious criticising Milner for conceding a free kick there when he’s put in that cross for the goal, feels equally ungracious criticising Benteke for not clearing the first ball into the box when he’s put us in the lead with that bloody header.
I’m going with the Milner option. We all know we’re not going to defend that free kick particularly well, so don’t give it away; you’re a senior pro, you’re the captain, you’re the calm experienced head. Be calm, be experience, be senior, be pro, stand your man up, close him off. All we had to do was take the sting out of the game for five minutes. All we had to do was KNOW we could take the sting out. We couldn’t. What we KNEW was we couldn’t, so that’s what we did; it’s a learnt behaviour. That’s why our heads fell off as soon as we scored, because we KNOW for an absolute, stone cold, certain FACT that when we score, we concede. So we did. THAT’s what we do at the moment, THAT’s what Jürgen’s seeing in the players’ eyes. That’s what he needs to deal with.
Which still isn’t the “Know what I don’t get” bit. That bit’s the bit he can’t deal with. Not immediately. It’s the bit he’s dealing with bit by bit by bit by bit, it’s the long term. It’s the tempering of us, the dealing with our reactions.
It’s this: It’s the comments from the stands. It’s the criticism of Daniel Sturridge for being injured again. As though it’s the lad’s fault. Pretty damn sure what he wants to do is play football. Pretty damn sure he doesn’t want to go from private hospital to private hospital getting scan after bloody scan after bloody scan and have blokes in white coats stick sharp things into various bits of his body that aren’t doing what he wants them to. Bit of sympathy for the lad might be nice. Bloody Sturridge. We should get rid. Waste of space, waste of time. Origi. Waste of a shirt. Should be changing it now. He’s shit, why haven’t we started Benteke? Err…because he’s been out for weeks and had half an hour of football so far and might break down and then we’d be buggered? Just a thought like, just throwing it out there. Origi doesn’t look very good at the moment but he’s our fourth choice striker and our only choice. I have vague memories of a young Thierry Henry not being very good in his first season in England, a young Ian Rush being unremarkable at nineteen in his first Anfield season. Thank Christ they didn’t have Twitter to pass judgement.
It’s this as well: It’s the reactions. It’s the online shite where we all tell each other stories and they become truths, where we all look at people who portray themselves as experts and so we believe them and we pass it on. I’ll hold my hands up on this one – I’m NOT an expert. I’m a bloke who goes the game and has a keyboard. Feel free to agree, feel free to tell me I’m talking shite, all opinions are valid on that one.
What’s not valid though? This: Clickbait sites with teaser taglines like ‘Liverpool Fans Destroy Player After Southampton Performance’ to drag you in. (Shall I name them? Shall I? Nah, they’ll know who they are). They get you, they snare you, they pass on the tweets you’ve already seen – or not seen but know are out there – and they reinforce the idea that Divock Origi is the Antichrist instead of a lad who’s just had a really poor 45 minutes of football. And the opinions go round and round and we take them as fact because the website has nice graphics and looks like it knows what it’s doing, but all it’s really doing is telling us what we’ve already said. It’s not giving an opinion, it’s not presenting argument, it’s just telling us what all of our 140 character outbursts have said. It’s opinion, nothing more. And this is opinion, nothing more: Divock Origi had a really poor 45 minutes on Sunday afternoon. It happens – deal with it, get some perspective, move on.
And it’s mainly this: It’s the exodus. 85 minutes gone, the other lads equalise and thousands stand up and head for the exit. Some of that I get. The bloke next to me, I get. He’s 80, he walks with a stick, getting out before the bulk of the 40,000 is pretty advantageous. And there are many in that position. Sound, I get that, fully understand. Everybody else though? “They’ve equalised, there’s no way back, I’m off” – don’t get that. 85 minutes, that’s nine minutes to go, we’ve been pushing all through the second half, Benteke and Firmino look good, there’s a chance. You can’t see it coming but you couldn’t see that bloody header coming either, could you?
This is the bit where we can do things, this is the bit where the miracles happen and the legends grow, this is the bit where you sing, where you scream, where you support. We’ve been doing it all through the second half; silent in the first but pretty much ‘us’ in the second, showing belief, showing desire, showing passion. Less of the getting onto the lads and more of the getting behind the lads going on, much more us. And they equalise and thousands go: “Nah”. Seriously, stick around, see what happens, it could be amazing. It wasn’t like but you didn’t KNOW that did you? Not KNOW it.
That’s the problem, we think we KNOW. Nobody KNOWS; they think, they expect, they assume, they don’t know, not KNOW know. The sooner we all, players and fans alike, stop thinking that we know it’s going to go wrong, the sooner it’ll stop going wrong. Law of attraction and all that, I could do a couple of thousand words on the law of attraction, take this as a taster: Expect the best and it’ll happen. Believe in the best, it starts heading toward you. Jürgen needs to have the lads in the red shirts believing that and we need to start showing the patience and understanding that gives him the time to alter their mindset. We need to alter OUR mindset, big style.
We want the world and we want it now. Jim Morrison said that.
We want everything immediately and when we don’t get it, we can’t figure out why it hasn’t happened. We might accept that we’re in this for the long haul, but we’re all convinced it’s far worse than it is and can’t see the good because we expect – because we condition ourselves to look for – the bad.
We’ve got a new dawn and we’re still playing with pessimism; the players and the supporters.
That’s what I don’t get.
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Pics: David Rawcliffe-Propaganda-Photo
Love this, Ian, and agree with pretty much all of it. Need to get out of the habit of looking for scapegoats for not being top of the league with a massive injury list and a squad that needs work. Coutinho and Origi need hugs, not trolls. I’m still beyond delighted when I see that caption on screen saying ‘Jurgen Klopp – Liverpool manager’, and it will take more than a few nervy draws to change that.
Brilliant article. The bit about Sturridge is so damn true. People calling him Injurridge and all. Like its his fault, like he wants to get injured.
Got to agree mate. Fans need to remove the negativity and give themselves a break. Try enjoying the game rather than enjoying giving criticism.
At least Jurgen is positive. Hopefully some of that will rub off….eventually.
BTW, tell the arl geezer to wait until the bulk of the fans have left rather than leaving before the end. At least that would be one more in the ground.
Sound summary Ian. JK is calling for calm……and you have nailed it perfectly…..its the supporters wandering off at 85 minutes that gets me, when the old stadium has witnessed so many late wins over the years helped by the crowd. The current Liverpool squad need have a look at Neil Mellors late finish against Arsenal because hey lads it can happen. That saying, the early departers need to look at late finishes over the years because, yes, it was them (The crowd) that won those games as well as the scorer! it won’t happen if they aren’t there!
Love every word of it. Hope you read my response. Here’s what I wrote on one of the thisisanfield.com articles after the Saints game:
“The impatience of some people is doing my head in. It’s basically pre-season for Klopp’s system in BR’s squad – suffering from severe “we’re gonna concede anyway” trauma. 2 weeks in.
The media hypes and bashes every genuine thing that’s out there till you can’t look at it no more. Ancelotti is a tactician that runs well-maintained squads, Klopp fixes things. LFC needs fixing, and he’ll deliver in due time.
RIght. Positive notes.
Moreno’s tackle against Mané was like watching a goal. Highlight reel stuff.
Big Ben’s header was superb (Milner actually delivered a good cross).
Klopp’s celebration was great, even Peter Krawietz went mental.
Under the circumstances, no defeats until now is a good thing, eh?”
Think that’s pretty much in tune with what is said here. But there’s something else about the fans. They regard themselves as exceptional singing YNWA very loudly at the start and end of the game. Here’s the tricky thing: it’s not where the support counts. It’s not what makes the fan exceptional.
What’s makes him exceptional is singing and supporting for the whole length of the game -regardless, or even because of- what’s happening on the pitch. 5 second chants don’t cut it if what follows are 10 minutes of dead silence, so quiet you can hear the players’ screams. Leaving early when you got 5 minutes to play is just shameful. Klopp wants the fans to believe in him but -most of all- the team. I think it’s time to make that happen again, because I’m sure one of the reasons Klopp joined is because it was this way once before.
absolutely agree about that Moreno tackle, fucking majestic. i can imagine there was a bunch of twats turning to each other and saying ‘can’t cross a ball for shit though’ befor he was back on his feet.
Fuckin ace this, well said. All the optimism and exuberance from Klopp coming in has already disintegrated, and it’s not because of the manager or the players – it’s because of the fans.
Nothing will change at Liverpool if the attitude of the fans doesn’t change. Jürgen’s been with us only a few weeks but he’s honed right in on the biggest problem. Kristian Walsh quoted him in the Echo today: “We saw how big the disappointment was of all people. It’s football. It’s only a goal. Nobody believed we could turn the game again, and that’s the first problem.”
The FIRST problem. Not the players, not the formation, not the youthful inexperience or the qualities of any particular player. Not the starting line-up or who was subbed and when. THE FIRST PROBLEM. Nothing will change at Liverpool if the fans don’t accept responsibility for the part they play in this huge FIRST problem that’s holding our club back.
Pessimism and defeatism bring only failure and defeat. Been saying this for a while in the comments on TAW articles. I’ll keep saying it.
What is funny here is you are one of the people Ian is talking about – the people on twitter criticising Daniel Sturridge for being injured again.
You’re always slagging him off, questioning his mentality, questioning his committment. Saying things like “frankly I’m not convinced Sturridge really wants to play football.” Saying he needs “to step the hell up.” Saying “he is no hurry to return as he is quietly funding his fashion model future on liverpool’s money.” This is vile stuff from a so-called fan. Sturridge wants to play, doesn’t want to be in pain or injured and whatever he does with HIS money is none of your business.
I know you probably skipped over that bit and would never dare disagree with any writer on here, or admit that they are referencing you, but I think Ian’s points are spot on and you might want to think on them a little bit. To speak of Sturridge the way you do then have the cheek to criticise other liverpool fans for their attitudes is very telling. People in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones. If you want to criticise Sturridge, fine, but don’t decry lfc fans for their views. If you want to do that, don’t slag off Sturridge every chance you get. It’s quite easy to not be a hypocrite.
LOL! One of the most pathetic things is people who have no life and actually spend their time stalking other people on Twitter, looking at their Tweet history with a desire to embarrass them — so rigidly fixed on their own dark world view that they can’t comprehend the concept of changing one’s opinion as changing circumstances warrant a reevaluation. One can only shake one’s head at how awful such a life must be — how dark such a mind must be.
Hmmm…..yet again an ad hominem attack and a total avoidance of the facts – you utterly despise the truth. Do you realise by doing this you are simply admitting I am right? That’s why you can’t defend your ridiculous accusations (without any evidence) on the professionalism of our best striker and resort to this sort of childish nonsense. If you are going to attack lfc fans yet behave the way you do, expect to be called out on your hypocritical bullshit.
By the way it takes literally 20 seconds to search “elena sturridge” in twitter to see what you say. It’s hardly time consuming. And you talk of changing your mind…it was only on October 22nd you were abusing Sturridge! Not even a week ago! So what’s happened to Sturridge in the last week that has caused you to change your mind? You also said you changed your mind on Klopp (the day he was appointed by LFC – what a coincidence) so it seems whenever someone points out your inconsistencies and hypocrisy you simply say you changed your mind, or privately message a forum moderator because you don’t like people telling the truth when it comes to your views. Instead, why not have a mature discussion about your opinions and the reasons for those opinions? Unless you feel they are impossible to defend rationally? After all you were the one lying about Klopp stating he wanted the Munich job and that he was sacked by Dortmund. But I forgot, you “changed your mind” about these things.
As Ian says, a bit of sympathy for Sturridge from liverpool fans might be nice, instead of idiotic remarks about what he does with the money he earns or his committment to the cause. The former is more supportive than the latter, and you say we are meant to support, right?
Best piece on here ever.
Ian, I want to give you a hug for this, ha ha.
“One of us (and I’m not saying who)….”
Why is there a need to pull punches? This one line ruins an otherwise good article. It was this stuff that annoyed me enormously when many of your contributors were writing about Rodgers this time last year.
There is literally no good reason not just to say if you or Robbo don’t rate Emre. Neither of you would be lynched, honest. TAW would not spontaneously combust. The world would not end. It doesn’t even take balls – many don’t think he’s good enough, especially off the ball.
Do us a favour and actually tell us what you think when discussing someone or something relating to LFC. Otherwise this whole exercise is just another dishonest corporate money-making scheme that would shame the socialism inherent in the city and in the club.
What a load of shite, Michael. Get a grip.
Is right, fuck me, what a bell.
Disappointing response. You failed to address the fact that Ian refuses to tell us what a member of TAW thinks about Emre Can. That’s what happened. I’ve just read it again. I haven’t lied or made it up, honest.
If it is too much to ask someone on a Liverpool fan site to tell us what he thinks of a Liverpool player, just say so. I’d have thought that sort of thing was just basic stuff and sort of the whole point.
I also have other examples of this to back up my point but you don’t seem in the mood to listen to any arguments that might make some sense. I fear you’ll ignore them with a similarly avoiding remark. You’re happy enough to receive my congratulations, plaudits and kind remarks but react like this at a clearly just criticism. As I said, disappointing.
Disappointing? Have a think. You think we’re going to give Ian a bell and ask him to rewrite based on your bizarre criticism? You’re making a problem when there isn’t one. Again. It’s tiresome. Give it a rest. No one is arsed but you. And the old chestnut about happy to accept praise blah blah blah. Happy to accept criticism as well. But this is just bollocks. Having a pop for the sake of it.
Well Mike, only you want this addressed. No one else gives a fuck.
What if that is the case? Should they just ignore a simple criticism because only one person made it? Do they go “well only one person said something so we’ll ignore it?” Or like intelligent adults would they be better analysing the criticism based on its own merits (not the amount of people making the criticism) and accept that just like all humans they make mistakes? After all it would be outrageously arrogant to think they never make the odd error. This is one. I’ve pointed it out.
What is clear though is they’ll always have some sycophants on hand, ready to defend them and brown nose them at a minute’s notice, never disagreeing with any article and always heaping praise on them regardless of content, making such comments incredibly tedious and entirely predictable. That isn’t their fault though. TAW do not promote disagreeing with them as a sin, although some round here appear to think it is.
“well only one person said something so we’ll ignore it?”
Unfortunately I don’t think it’s a case of “only one person” being the issue. I think it’s you being that person.
You micro-analysed an article, found something remotely insignificant and decided it’s contentious. Got told to grow up and then decided the whole of the AW is a “corporate money-making scheme that would shame the socialism inherent in the city and in the club”
I think they and most would want to avoid engaging with you.
Ironically I have engaged with you, but I’m a bit bored. I’ll apologise and move on.
Can you read? I never said TAW was “a corporate money-making scheme that would shame the socialism inherent in the city and in the club”
I said if they did not honestly tell us what they thought about something relating to LFC, in this case Emre Can, then otherwise that is what they’d become. The operative words being “if” and “otherwise.” Reading is quite easy mate. Give it a try.
And plenty of people engage with me on here. Three in this thread alone. But somehow I don’t think you’ll let facts get in the way of thinking what you will. I’ll stick to honest praising and justifiable criticising when I see fit, you stick to brown nosing at all costs, devaluing any praise you do give. Well in.
Haha. I love it.
I don’t see how you would come to this conclusion if you were actually listening to the pods and reading the articles here.
The lads criticised Rodgers throughout last season but based on tactics, selection etc. Just because they never resorted to calling him clueless or a fraud, or saying he gets his player info from watching Match of the Day, let alone referring to his teeth, his goal celebrations, his marital status, doesn’t mean he wasn’t criticised. To take an example: in the second game versus Man City, Martin Fitzgerald memorably made the comment about Liverpool being like a punk band that were trying to play their instruments properly and seek broadsheet critics’ approval – absolutely spot-on criticism but witty, not petty. And throughout the season and the start of this there was a steady flow of similarly mature (though occasionally drunken) assessments.
I follow TAW precisely for the intelligence and balance of views, which is a world away from the shrill hysteria elsewhere.
Well analysed and argued piece and a real message to the fans that go. They need to do the job that comes with the ticket. A responsibility to get the team across the line whatever the setbacks. At least Jurgen sees it and will address it with the players. He may need to teach them to ignore the crowds apprehension and just fight like he said from the start.
Those of us who can’t go will be patient. With Rodgers I frequently stopped watching TV cos it was so bad……now I never miss a minute because Jurgen will not accept defeatism. The players are under immense pressure, but that goes with the territory. It’ll be survival of the fittest and strength of character will be demanded. If not they know they can move on. Change is slowly emerging and some players are rising to the challenge and will battle through. Who will last the course only time will tell but I still think we have the best manager in the world
Thank you for this Ian. I was beginning to think I was the only one that thought there have been positives to take from each of the first 3 games. You have summed up how I feel perfectly.
What I am extremely disappointed by is the reaction of some of the so-called supporters. So quick abandon the team, to get on players’ backs, to leave the stadium early. It took decades for Liverpool and its fans to earn a reputation as a special club, and I feel that over the space of a short period of time, that reputation is being tarnished.
Since I am not from England, I had a choice as to which football club I wanted to support, and as I like to say, Liverpool found me. It was the history, the city, the songs, and most of all the unwavering support of the fans. The passion. I fell in love with LFC. That was nearly 20 years ago. I don’t feel like that would have happened had I been searching for a club now.
It may just be a sign of the times. There is no patience anymore. Managers aren’t given any time, young players are sold before they have a chance to prove themselves. Twitter and social media gives a voice to the most vile and idiotic among us.
Some of the behavior that was displayed over the past year or so by some fans was absolutely toxic. What ever happened to “you’ll never walk alone.” It no longer means anything, or rather should be amended with, “as long as we’re winning”.
I will continue to support the team on the pitch and the manager in the dugout as long as they are representing LFC. Yes, even Divock Origi, Lovren, Lallana, et al. I even hope our previous manager goes on to find success wherever he goes next.
Everything in life takes time, and it is no different in football. We must have the patience to let Klopp mould this team, and for our younger players to develop. And in the meantime, we must support them and remain optimistic about what is to come. If not, there is no point to any of this.
Wowser. “…dishonest corporate money-making scheme…” — and here’s me thinking all along how very lucky Liverpool fans are to have a top-quality site like TAW that offers highly intelligent, well-informed, reasonable, witty, passionate and thoroughly entertaining commentary written by fans for fans and presented to a high standard of excellence — this article being a fine example of all those characteristics. My, oh my…
Reminding myself….
From the Oxford English Dictionaries:
PESSIMISM (noun): a tendency to see the worst aspect of things or believe that the worst will happen; a lack of hope or confidence in the future. SYNONYMS: defeatism, negativity, doom and gloom, gloominess, miserablism, cynicism, fatalism.
Why post your response here? There is a reply button for a reason.
Are you commenting on this because you can’t answer the factual examples of you criticising Sturridge which anyone can see if they so want? Which of course means you complaining about LFC fans’ attitudes makes you a hypocrite? You never seem to have an answer for the truth.
When I was in school a girl kept saying Paul Weller had big ears. I saw it half as an insinuation that because of that his music was crap. So I went on the defensive. We argued about it for about 2 weeks and she always tried to wind me up over it. This was pre-internet days so I said, I’ve got a picture of the Jam on my wall, come round and tell me his ears are big. So she did and after a bit more arguing….well, I won’t go into detail on here. I’ve had other similar situations. I suppose everyone has. The saying ‘the best part about an argument is the making up’ is a saying for a reason. I still enjoy it when a woman argues with me. I wonder if deep down the same psychology is at play between you and Michael. Who knows how this feud will end, haha. It’s quite intense though.
Ha, I’m only joking Ellie, love. Just trying to lighten things up. Klopp said we have to start a clean slate anyway. Personally, I think you both talk a lot of sense and both display more passion and affection for LFC than most. It’s a shame it’s got like this. If this is what you both wanna do though it’s up to you two. Just be careful though if Michael starts saying Rodgers teeth are too white, whatever you do don’t ask him to come round to prove it.
Haha, Robin! I think your teeth reference is funny. I’ve been thinking lately that we’re seeing a lot more of Jürgen’s hugely toothy white wide-mouthed grin than we ever saw of Brendan’s pearly whites. He only ever gave us sly smiles as a sign of his subtle sense of humour, which few people seemed to grasp because they were too busy hating on him. I heard recently that he’s possibly joining beIN Sports network as a pundit. They’re headquartered in Doha, Qatar, and they broadcast to hundreds of millions in a variety of countries. Can’t help wondering if FSG helped him out by working their connections over there on his behalf.
Ha. Wow, I’ll be honest, that would surprise me (although as a short term position not so much). I’d expect him to take 4 – 6 months off and come back managing in the Prem. When you look at the managers outside the top 5 then I’m sure he could walk into any of those positions. I felt for Klopp when they equalised and he smiled. I can see why he’s such a hit in Germany. Top bloke and just what we need at this juncture in life. I feel similar to him though about the circus. We had a laugh at the press conferences, we followed him into town and thought he was cool for going for a drink, we believed we could win the World Cup under him next season but I’m bored of it now. He’s really won me over and it annoys me he’s being seen as a cross between Mourinho and Stan Laurel. It couldn’t be further from the truth from what I’m seeing.
I don’t see him coming back into a PL management position anytime soon, but he may prove me wrong. Considering all the personal loss he’s endured in the past 4 years and the intensely vile abuse hurled at him over the last year, I had the distinct impression he was not well physically (ulcers…?) during the last several months of his tenure, revealed on multiple occasions by his body language, some behaviours, and his general demeanour.
The random thought crossed my mind last night that he may lower his stress and take time to recover by biding his time for a while as an international English-speaking pundit for beIN (which BTW was formerly Al Jazeera Sports). This could give him an opportunity to watch a variety of teams play in varying circumstances. Then, later possibly make a play toward managing an international team, or maybe even an American club. He’s got Charlotte and her young daughter to think about, and that may impact where they decide to take up their next residence. It’s tricky.
Ha Robin. I sometimes think I should be more like you. You were still so polite and patient with Ellie despite the disagreement you had on twitter when she was posting year old photos of Rodgers and Sterling standing beside one another as categorical proof that there was no issue in their relationship in May 2015. I admired how calm you were in explaining that you had photos of friends married but are now divorced so the photos prove nothing. I just can’t put up with such bullshit. If I see it I’m going to call people out on it. As for your other suggestion…..ha! Lets just say Elena is considerably older than me.
Enough Michael. It wont be long before everyone becomes aware that nearly every post from Elie is a slight on our fans. Not knowing her I cant work out if its anti scouse, socialist or LFC. She certainly has an axe to grind,
I am a believer and yet I fall into the category Jurgen was describing. I screamed when Milner gave that foul as we had just discussed them bringing on their dead ball specialist, I couldnt help it I had a good idea what was about to happen.
I believe Jurgen will be a top manager for us but after following the Reds for many years through mostly good but some dark days I have never been so nervous watching games. I can only imagine most people feel the same and if you do its so hard to sing when your stomach is churning.
I dont envy the ‘its only a game’ minded fans. football is about passion, its just I dont know how we change and enjoy again there is so much at stake these days esp with the CL.
PS. I am actually dreading Daniel playing in case he gets injured, bizarre!
LOL! I’m a non-violent person so no axe. I love Liverpool, everything about it and about Liverpool Football Club and our fans — EXCEPT I don’t love seeing our reputation tarnished by the vile abuse perpetrated by a segment of our fan base on social media who were bent on destroying the reputation of a respectable man. I don’t love that our fans moan perpetually and that they’re constantly looking for scapegoats. There’s no need for any of it because results on the pitch always determine the outcome. It’s also weak and represents a way of looking at the world that I choose not to subscribe to. I want to be proud of our support; unfortunately, during the past year there have been too many times when I wasn’t.
Regarding MP, his obsession has become entertaining, always good for a late-night laugh.
Great stuff. But the Kop was singing at the end. The problem is the gits in the main and centenary stands. I sat next to a couple of elective mutes on Sunday in the upper centenary with three young pillockis in front who were far too cool to sing YNWA or shout support etc. I moan about poor passes etc but I applaud good play (even from the opposition sometimes). Don’t understand how people go the game and don’t get involved. I’m 68 and still get the buzz I got back in 1957. Puzzling.
Great stuff Ian but you need to cut a bit of slack here and there.I remember reading a biography of an ex Liverpool player (I can’t remember who it was;I’ve read so many) and he couldn’t wait to hear about the big secret.He was searching for it but never found it.Later he realised that we did the simple things very well….and nobody within the Club thought of it as a secret;it was what they always did things.
And then we got Brendan who told us he had a big secret and we would soon see the effects.He was being paid upwards of about £5 million a year to reveal that big secret but it never came.I’ve really no sympathy there.It was a bit like Paul Daniels or Dymano standing on top of the Eiffel Tower one minute then appearing on top of the Empire State Building the next.We soon realised it was trick photography.
So now we’ve got Jurgen.And three games later he’s still standing on top of the Eiffel Tower.And some fans want him to be standing on top of the Empire State Building.Can you blame them or us? Or the players for that matter?
There are many things I see in Klopp’s demeanour;not least of them his ability to lighten things up and relax the players.I wouldn’t say that they are all the greatest players we’ve ever had but sometimes players just playing with belief and confidence rather than being shackled with some kind of painting by numbers formations and tactics is all they need.
So,just have a little patience with Klopp.And the fans.
Hallelujah! Nice work Ian. When did so many of our fan base become such a shower of knobs? Can they either sort it out or else sod off as, like millions of others, economics and geography prevent me from attending so it’d be nice when watching the match on the box if those present sounded like they gave a shit. Klopp just came from Dortmund, who look like they spend the whole game making a proper racket. Isn’t that what we’re supposed to be famous for, among other things?
Lots of wisdom here. Best thing I’ve read about Liverpool this year, and especially since Klopp came in. We need to be more cool. We need to believe more. We need more positivity and patience. Ultimately, we really need to enjoy this more.
This is also expressed in what Klopp has been saying…we create a self-fulfilling prophecy. We need to cool off, be patient, be confident, and start believing again.
And if we’d shut off Twitter and stop watching the post-match media frenzies, we’d all be better off as well.
Great article Ian.
Nice comment, Travis. If I had to pick 3 catchwords for Liverpool fans at the present time they would be BELIEVE, SUPPORT, ENJOY!
MP is right, Ellie, you are always giving Sturridge down the banks. It is more likely you and Robin will be taking advantage of Premier Inn’s special deals than you and Michael
Haha. I’m staying in the premier inn in Wembley at the minute. P.s. I’m not being suggestive here, just saying.
you old dog!
Actually, I’m not. I’ve probably written more messages of strong encouragement and support to Daniel Sturridge over that last 18 months than any other fan. But I can’t help it if I do sometimes see a look in his eyes or get a feeling from his body language that he’s less than burning to get back on the pitch. And I can’t help it if some people put him on a pedestal and choose to blind themselves to the reality that he’s been out more than he’s been in, while the club continues to pay him a huge salary and we have a gigantic gap in our strike force while we wait for him.
There were also reports last season that he outright refused to play unless he felt 100% fit, while Lallana and Hendo and others were taking injections to mask their pain so they could play as much as possible. And Škrtel was back out on the pitch minutes after having his split-open head stapled. I see the world the way it is, not how I’d like it to be, and it is what is. If Daniel really wants to play football he’ll find a way.
Three games undefeated. This glass half-full thing is pretty good!
‘We want everything immediately and when we don’t get it, we can’t figure out why it hasn’t happened.’
Twitter fuels the above. Don’t do it. The message is in the medium.
Brilliant, brilliant article. Best read I can recall, and there are excellent articles on this site every week.
Thanks, Ian.
Also enjoyed most of the comments, affirming the article. I think more and more are becoming tired of the negativity.
I’ve turned Twitter off a long time ago. Took a 12-step program to break the habit. I just wish there was a universal off-switch for it. The world would be better for it.
I said as soon as Henderson got injured things are going to take a turn for the worse. They did and we still haven’t recovered. Milner is a good squad player but not good enough to lead a team full of youngsters who’s heads drop at the change of the wind. I’d seriously look at getting Gerrard back now the season in the USA has finished. Was against it earlier on in the season but we need a leader to pick some of these players heads up and one that knows how to hold onto a lead. Best move jurgen could make and the fans would be made up as well.
fantastic article…sums me up in a way forever the worrier and expecting the bad, even when we went 1 up I was thinking straight away wished it was the ninety third minute.
Jurgen Klopp is doing the best he can with the formerly Brendan Rodgers team.
They really are better. They show aggressiveness and fight.
We KNOW Jurgen Klopp is a great coach. The issue is that he doesn’t have an effective leader on the pitch who can get the others to work.
Especially in defense, Martin Skrtel is a bartering ram…not a scalpel or a leader. They need one at the back.
This will all take time. Am I happy we lost 2 points while holding one? No but this will take him. Just give it to them.
Maybe the rumors are right and Markovich will be back in January.
Ignoring all of the mad bellends on here that constantly have a pop at each other, CLASS article Ian, nice one.
Particularly the bit about the translation of Weds-Sat > Thurs-Sun. Always killed me that one.
Thanks mate.