I MIGHT as well tell you now – this isn’t going to be popular.
Four years ago today, Fenway Sports Group/New England Sports Ventures took over Liverpool Football Club and delivered us from evil. For many it was like the last few minutes of Return of the Jedi. Okay, there were no statues to topple as such and the Main Stand car park wasn’t filled with spear carrying woolly dwarves [Well, not all the time – Ed] but there was a euphoric sense of change in the air. Darth Hicks and Darth Gillett were on a pyre somewhere surrounded by grieving relatives and the ghost of two Jedi mas…Okay, I’ll abandon that.
There then came the court case. Lord Grabiner became an Anfield hero for ten minutes, Purslow was giving it a full Henman fist pump on the steps of the High Court and we could begin again. FSG were in. Only one problem remained. An extraordinary problem housed in iron hair, 1950s tactics and the inability to know just how his next sentence was going to end. That said, he read a lot of books. No problem. The new owners stepped in, gave him his carriage clock and sent him on his way. Hooray! Proper owners and a proper manager in the dugout. Liverpool were back. Balance had been restored to the Force. Or something.
A few months later I was on the Kop with my mates, watching us sidle past a fairly poor Newcastle side, when it dawned on me that this was the first time in a long while that I was actively enjoying every aspect of the game. We’d had the Rafa civil war, the two Darths, Grand Moff Hodgson and now everyone around me was laughing and joking. This is what the game is supposed to be about. Protesting is necessary and arguing about tactics etc. is part of the fun but ultimately laughing with your mates and a load of strangers is why we’re here. Who could complain about Fenway after that?
Yes, this isn’t going to be popular and it’s entirely down to my own prejudice and inability to shrug off a grudge.
Here it comes.
I don’t see Fenway in a halo of light as others do. In my time I’ve had their logo on a dartboard, shouted at their empty seats in the Main Stand and developed a strong distaste for the Boston Red Sox. Oh, my anger has dissipated to the point of indifference but I’ll still mumble to myself when they’re praised in my hearing. You’re probably ahead of me here.
Yes, it was the Kenny sacking. I know, I know. I won’t go on about it too much but I didn’t take it well and it still gets beneath my ribs in unguarded moments. Not that there wasn’t grounds for dismissal, though I still dispute them, but for the fact it was done by a man in a Boston boardroom surrounded by people who didn’t know the first thing about the game. They sacked Kenny Dalglish. It’s like me having a slash on the Washington Monument in front of them. They owned the club, were tasked with improving it but for me they always lacked that right not to give the greatest living man in our history more than a season to prove himself. I can never completely forgive them for that. To make matters worse I made a fool of myself on various fan fora and ranted to all and sundry, making plenty of enemies on the way. Hi, lads. Hope you’re well.
Hindsight is a great thing. We are markedly better than we once where. Champions League football seemed a distant dream four years ago and to be involved in a title challenge again was superb. I’ve no worries on that score. It’s just…just…
Well, it’s a bias and one I’ll freely own. I don’t like businessmen in football. Yes, I know that it’s ‘all a business now’ and that ‘commercial income is important’ but I was never going to wave my scarf at the Directors Box – particularly after what they did to Kenny. It all seems a bit unseemly and once I saw John Henry ask Charlie Adam ‘Do you know who I am?’ on that God awful documentary. I knew we could never be friends. I bet he’s gutted.
Obviously, this enmity was a mere snack compared to the veritable feast of hatred I had for their predecessors but it was still there nonetheless. I was no admirer of David Moores either, even before the stupidest sale in our history. I met him once and found that, for all his faults, he at least genuinely loved the club. He could get the ground without the aid of a SatNav. We’re just a piece of paper in FSG’s portfolio – not the apple of their eye. True, it could be said that lack of attachment may remove unwanted emotions to tough decision but there should be love there, there should be a sense of belonging. Linda waving a gloved hand from the director’s box isn’t especially inspiring.
As FSG are personified by John Henry so I took out most of my ire on him. That photo of him sneering down on Dalglish after the Cup Final defeat still makes me furious. It may be your club, John, but don’t do that to a man who means more to us than you ever will. I know Kenny’s back in the fold now but even that role seems a waste of his talents. Yeah, I know. I’ll get over it. Give me a couple of decades.
Then there’s the Arsenal tweet which many of our fans adored. I didn’t. I thought it was unnecessary and as much as it’s funny to see the teacher drop the mask it seemed a little crass. Should we ever sign a player from Arsenal it’ll almost certainly cost us a few million more now. I’ll admit that there’s hypocrisy at play as I was more than happy with Dalglish telling Wenger to piss off in the dugout but from the owner? Nah. Save that for the boardroom, John.
Speaking of saving, can we dispel this myth that they saved the club? No. They. Didn’t. They’re hedge fund owners, venture capitalists, not a deus ex machina plot device in ‘The Story of LFC’. They didn’t chance upon our ailing club and decide to reach down from Mount Olympus and allow us to suckle on their nourishing teat for the sake of it. We were a good business deal and they knew it. There’s nothing wrong with that and it’s been to our general good, but John Henry isn’t dressed in robes distributing largesse to the poor. Let’s not kiss anyone’s feet just yet.
I say ‘general good’ despite my own prejudices as they have done some worthwhile things. For example, the decision to re-develop Anfield instead of moving is a wise one. The events of 2012 plus The FSG Arena or whatever may well have killed me off completely. For all the talk of progress and ‘we have to move on’, Liverpool play at Anfield. THIS Anfield. That’s not a boardroom decision or a progress move – that’s just something that a lot of people, people who have made this place their home, feel about that square of land. Well done for that.
There is still much to do and much to improve. On the whole though, and I can sense my 2012 self slapping me hard in the face for suggesting such a thing, they’ve done okay. If there was one objective criticism it would be the lack of leadership in the ground itself. I’ve always wanted to live in a footballing age where the Liverpool chairman could walk about unnoticed due to a personal preference for incognito but they might improve things from within if they were here to see the problems first hand. I still can’t abide chairmen who show up on talk-ins and bang on about their Wembley injuries etc. but it’s still necessary for them to at least be in the building to nip any silly mistakes in the bud. Remember the leafleting of Anfield for the Fulham game a while back when the Hillsborough inquest asked people to come forward and make statements? The club said no – a decision presumably made by Ayre and Ged Poynton. It was an incredibly stupid thing to do and using litter as an excuse (how many mosaics have we had, lads?) made it worse. One phone call from Boston later and reason had found its chair. That’s what we should be doing and that volte-face was impressive. ‘No’ may be the easiest answer but it’s not always the right one.
I had hoped that this new broom would look at ticket prices. The greatest thing about last season’s away games was the sound of young Scouse voices in the crowd. I love that and it’s sorely missed at Anfield. Paying £40-£50 per game is out of the question for most people but young lads and lasses have little chance of building up credits with those sorts of prices. Much has been said about the gentrification of the game and although all are welcome, it would significantly improve the ‘match day experience’ if there was a bit more Liverpool in Liverpool Football Club. This is no way to denigrate supporters from anywhere else but making prices affordable would make Anfield less like a cinema and more like the base of civic pride that it was always meant to be.
I took my London-born niece to the West Brom game last week. She loved the strong Scouse accent from the man behind me. She found it funny and unusual. I just wished there were more like them. See, I was lucky. Growing up, the most important thing in the world to me was only a bus ride away. I could get in, stand with my mates and watch my team. It’s practically impossible for a 17 year old kid to have that same experience today and it’s something the club should be looking at. Again, you can’t really notice that if you’re an ocean away. It costs £30 just for the chance to buy a ticket and even then you need a laptop, a strong Wi-Fi connection and the patience of Job.
Then there’s the corporates. Hedge fund owners like making money and FSG are no exception. So far they’ve tied up that crucial coffee partnership to go with our official airline partners and whatever other logos we’ve jemmied onto the sponsorship boards. Once again I know that we wouldn’t be able to compete without whoring ourselves out to those who are keen to ‘align with the brand’ and, yes, it’s important but half and half LFC/Standard Chartered scarves and a six foot lipstick red dinosaur? Well, it isn’t what I signed up for.
An FSG presence may also help the worldwide fan community. Remember the Anne Williams flag in Indonesia? It now flies on the Kop at every home game. Well, it belongs to an Indonesian student called Sammy. Sachin Nakrani had the idea to bring him over and be reunited with his flag. The club had made a fortune from that tour and the goodwill in that part of the world was sky high so we approached them and asked if they a) liked the idea and b) would they help out with flights, accommodation etc. They refused all requests but said that they’d gladly retweet anything from their official social media account. No practical help at all.
I’m not criticising them for saying no as such, that’s their prerogative, but to do nothing other than offer a few mouse clicks and ignoring a chance to unite both parts of the world under a banner we can all get behind was short-sighted in the extreme. It’s effortless PR for the club. ‘No’, again, was the easiest answer. If there was an FSG affiliate in situ, someone who can see the bigger picture, then maybe things would be different.
Their report card shows a marked improvement following a fairly awful start. I’ll admit that it’s a difficult one to play. I’d like them to be quiet but more vocal, stay over there so I don’t have to look at them but at the same time be over here and help out a bit more. They should also stay away from Twitter feeds, PR documentaries and mascots. I’m not asking for much.
6/10
Agree with almost all of this. If we’re scoring FSG etc then I’m afraid my score is considerably lower.
FSG 4/10
Article 9/10
Dalglish 10/10
Decent article, but I disagree with you on most, if not all counts. Football is now business, as you’ve alluded to in the article, and having come so close to administration and absolute disaster, it was absolutely necessary to bring in some new thinking and move the club into the 21st century. It may be painful for some of the old hands, but I’d much rather watch our club flourish in this new world than slowly wither away, as it would have done without these business people and their focus on commercialising every opportunity.
As for reuniting the person who made that Anne Williams flag in Indonesia? It’s just a fancy way of asking the club to fund a free holiday for someone. Fantastic gesture by that person, regardless.
On sacking KK, the club needed a long term plan and KK was just a stop gap while the owners prepared. He was never the manager to provide the sort of new thinking/ coaching the club needed, to move into the present. I understand he filled the role knowing he was just an interim manager.
Liverpool football club is now being run as a business. It is the only way to stay competitive. We know there is a cost to the fans, but this cost allows us to compete at the top end. You can’t have your cake and eat it too. We all need to “get real”.
It wasn’t a ‘free holiday’. We wanted him to be a guest of the cluba nd for them to help out with visa letters etc. He wanted to come over to the service rather than a game. We’re still looking to do something but we don’t know how yet.
No was the easier answer so I won’t be asking again.
Very well put across. I don’t necessarily agree with it all but well said, fair and balanced
Thing is, Liverpool haven’t been a very good investment, they may have purchased the club at a snip but it’s cost them money annually every year since. From a good investment you’d have expected a yield by no later than Y3. it may well turn out to be a great investment but four years in and it’s been nothing but a drain on them as a business.
The Fulham and Flag situation is typical and comically bad from the club once again, we continuously land ourselves in trouble all the time. They’re basics we should be doing, not out of point scoring for the PR team but out of goodwill to the fans.
Can’t really question them from a commercial point of view, they’ve dragged us from the dark ages really. We may not like it as fans, But it’s important, I’d be worried if we were carrying on pre FSG and lagging behind so it’s refreshing to see growth for once.
Good article, keep it up chief
Fuck me. Sadden me, and embarrasses me a bit, that some LFC fans think like this. Even more remarkable in the modern game.
Sacking Kenny was the second best decision FSG have made since buying the club.
We were a disgrace in the league and under a completely out of touch Dalglish – obvious modern football had passed him by to everyone except those Liverpool fans who exalt him as an infallible deity – we would have got nowhere near 84 points in a season and the title. Cup runs with easy draws are not what we are, or should be, about.
His tactics? Downing wide, Adam set pieces, whip in it for £35m Andy Carroll. £35m. Andy. Carroll. A joke.
Incredible player, unreal first stint in charge as boss, steadied the ship when taking over from Hodgson (FSG’s best decision since buying the club) but should never have been made permanent manager thereafter.
Yet it seems some of our fans just can’t let go the idea of Kenny as the returning Messiah ready to steamroll England and Europe again, despite the game having been completely turned on its head in between his disastrous stints as Newcastle and Celtic manager and his return to Anfield.
Let it go. FSG were correct to sack him. Even if they had appointed a mug after and we were still languishing in 7th or 8th they’d have been right. That hasnt happened though. FSG got one of the brightest young manager-coaches in Europe and after taking 12 months to right Kenny’s wrongs (getting rid of a load of dead wood and sorting out the wage bill in a massive way, a feat he doesnt get enough credit for) we put in our best season in nearly a quarter of a century.
If you want the club you love to be successful in todays game you need to move with the times. If we can’t get a billionaire owner ready to buy the title then you get the next best thing – incredibly intelligent businessmen with a track record of awakening sleeping sporting giants, who have a ruthless drive to succeed in order to make money. Thats what we have and Im grateful for it.
Always easy in hindsight, Chris. And you’re equalising out all “those Liverpool fans who exalt him as an infallible deity” by… Sticking the boot in on the club’s greatest living legend two and a half years after he’s stopped being manager?
And the “cup runs with easy draws” is just a weird shout when we knocked City and United out of both cup comps in the same week.
But this is exactly the point! Hindsight, or evidence, has proven FSG correct in their decision to sack Kenny!
Unless you are telling me Dalglish would have achieved 87 points with Downing and Carroll and Adam in the team?
Unless you are telling me Dalglish would have realised what a colossal fuck up he’d made by not only buying such players but by putting them on such ridiculous wages that it would have been very difficult or extremely expensive to have moved them on?
Because Brendan realised it and immediately set about sorting it out.
Sticking the boot in you say? No, I gave facts. And whether or not he is our greatest ever player (second greatest in my opinion) is completely and utterly irrelevant to his record as manager in his second spell in charge. Completely. And utterly. Irrelevant.
Cup runs with easy draws:
League Cup = Exeter, Brighton, Stoke, Chelsea Reserves who had given up playing for Villas Boas (team included Turnball, Bertraund, Romeu, McEachran & 17 year old Lukaku), Man City (fair enough, you can have that one) and Cardiff (won on penalties)
FA Cup = Oldham, Man Utd (fair enough, you can have that one), Brighton, Stoke, Everton and a non reserve no managed by Villas-Boas Chelsea, who beat us
2 tough wins in 12 ties = an easy draw for me
Tough one really, given the emotional ties. I, like you, think that the interim decision was inspired, the permanent one less so. It was a bottle job, and quite understandable given the level of support. And let’s not forget, we did play good football initially. Those signings really hurt us though.
Who’s your favourite player out of interest? For me Keegan, Souness and Hansen are all good shouts but I think it often depends on who you grew up watching. We’ve had so many great players.
“Cup runs with easy draws are not what we are, or should be, about.”
And when did we become a fucking Chelsea or a Tottenham and start getting rid of managers after barely a few months in the role. Embarrassing.
Regarding Dalglish, it was a tough one. I think he was sacked because he and Comolli spent Champions League money without finishing anywhere near the top four. Winning the league cup was a nice boost and it gave players (e.g. Kuyt, Agger) who had been at the club for a while the chance to waggle some silverware over their heads. It was never going to be enough for the owners though, which shows where the priority of all club owners lie. Maybe that was the reason for Henry’s indifference at Wembley.
While not hitting Hodgson-level turgidity, the football was often bland and uninspiring; perhaps as a consequence of buying players seemingly for two different teams which never quite fitted together. Once Lucas got injured Charlie Adam, who I’m sure was bought as a purely attacking midfielder, was positioned deeper where his lack of pace and inability to win back the ball was cruelly exposed. Downing put in loads of crosses to… er, I’m not sure who. It certainly was n’t Suarez, who seemed resigned to try and win matches on his own without the help of the big lummox he was partnered with.
It would have been great to have marched back into the Big Cup under Dalglish, but he failed to show a clear direction of where the team were heading under him by the end of his first full season. Harsh, but managers are given such little time and maybe, given how long he’d been out of management, he was n’t prepared for that either. Rodgers may not have solved everything in his first season, but he knew the style of football he wanted to play and the transition to his second season could be identified.
he showed that he couldn’t bring players on (eg Hendo) and there was serious questions in the identification of talent too. And there certainly was no care in the amount spent.
Oh good grief! So because Henderson wasn’t an instant hit it showed KD “couldn’t bring players on”? A bit like Thierry Henry’s first season flop at Arsenal showed Wenger “couldn’t bring players on”, eh?
I love Kenny, with all my heart, but 35m for Andy Carroll has to be just about the worst piece of business in our history. He was never a Liverpool player in a million years. Granted Kenny didn’t negotiate the price but what were he and Commoli thinking? 35m for a carthorse designed for route one football? We were incredibly fortunate that Big Sam likes a big man……
Agree with every word. Hate the way the wools laud FSG as some latter day saints. Prices are higher than ever, accessibility of tickets for most more difficult than ever. £59 to get into Anfield for a domestic cup tie. And we’re meant to be grateful to them? No thanks pal.
This is unfair for two reasons
1) They haven’t actually charged £59 to get into Anfield for a domestic cup tie. They have just said that is the maximum they might charge
2) You’ve just quoted the top tier price and ignored all the cheaper ones
The second point is more important. Because I would love LFC to come out and say they are happy to reduce the amount they make overall from ticket revenue to make it fairer for fans, but this seems very, very unlikely to happen. So the only way we will get cheaper tickets in Anfield is if we accept that some fans with the best seats in the house have to pay more. (Which is what happens in Germany. Not everyone is paying 15 Euro). But when our own supporters consistently use the top level price as a stick to beat FSG with, then they are become less likely to do that too. Which is a shame
1) They haven’t actually charged £59 to get into Anfield for a domestic cup tie. They have just said that is the maximum they might charge
2) You’ve just quoted the top tier price and ignored all the cheaper ones
… John, that top price is there for a reason. It will be charged at some point. As for cheaper tickets – really? There was the discount game v Utrecht, but most of the time the cheapest way to get into Anfield is the best part of £30. If these owners actually realised WHAT they’ve bought here, and thought a bit creatively, they’d know they have the potential to build and run something special and unique – a club with heavy links to its region, a die hard noisy fanbase and worldwide appeal. They should buy into that, not just see everything through the grey filters of a balance sheet.
I’m not a sentimentalist and I’m not against progress or change. The likes of me and Karl aren’t stuck in a 1988 timewarp, and we understand the world has moved on. We’d just like Liverpool FC to behave in an inclusive, engaged manner which goes beyond a mascot, a fly on the wall documentary or the owner’s wife pouting and waving from the director’s box. To behave in a way which is recognisably scouse and Liverpudlian. That’s not too much to ask?
What I meant was £59 is the most expensive (non corporate) ticket in the house. Most people won’t pay that. I would like to see cheaper tickets subsidised even more by more expensive ones, but it won’t happen if people deliberately keep quoting the most expensive price as if that is how much all the tickets cost as a stick to beat FSG with (but funnily enough quote the cheapest price when talking about what people pay in Germany).
FWIW I largely agree with you, I just don’t think exaggeration (on either side, see my posts below) particularly helps.
I am generally more ambivalent about FSG than the author, however:
1. If you price-out young supporters from your home city, you are by definition thinking short term.
2. Unquestionably, the high ticket prices exclude key local support and negatively impact match day atmosphere.
3. Unfortunately for fans, the expansion of Anfield may not help reduce ticket price points, as FSG needs turnover to rise dramatically to meet FIFA financial fair play regulations.
4. One possible route to solving this issue would be to consider (safe) German-style standing on the Kop. This isn’t in FSG’s financial interest, but expect them to object on different grounds.
5. Another worrying development is American-style, self-congratulatory Marketing Week puff like this: http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/exclusive—580-million-reasons-7922473 Do we care about this cheeseball? Why are The Echo praising him for just doing his job?
6. And yes, Mighty Red is a patronising, cultural abomination – but if FSG get their marketing right, he will make more in China and the USA than Everton make in global shirt sales.
3dunno how you square the young supporters thing. The world has moved on. £50-£60 tickets are easily saleable. Business will exploit that but it means older and quieter fans.
Until we care about real industry and jobs rather than London and the finance industry then the rich/poor divide will grow ever larger and footy moves more into the luxury category.
Brits aint about to give up on house price rises and demand a change, so it’s self fullfilling.
Are the seat prices too high? I totally agree, which is why Anfield is always empty on match day.
Oh wait, no, that’s wrong. Anfield is always packed to the gills. So *someone* is paying the price to attend, and therefore by extrapolation, the price is right. When the price is too high, people *will* stop attending.
On the Kenny sacking; totally the right decision. BR has the potential to be one of the greats, as long as he’s given time to build the team he wants. He had it pretty perfect last year (except for an OAP in midfield), but he’s in for two years of rebuilding, I’d say.
Stop crying about ticket prices. If ticket prices were to come down to a level at which those who complain about them would be happy, we’d be playing Forest and Wednesday every week. That ship has sailed. Did so about 22 years ago. If you want to turn the clock back to the 80s and stick your fingers in your ears and pretend the last quarter century hasn’t happened, and we’re still champions, and we can play a season with 14 squad players, and Dalglish is still relevant to current management, and pies cost a pound, and there’s only one live match on TV a week, and Brian Moore is the commentator, and it’s two points for a win, and United are mid-table clowns, and Chelsea are even lower and consider Micky Droy a good player, if you want to inhabit this world, be my guest. But don’t drag the rest of us into your sad little fantasy.
Utter bullshit Doug.
Liverpool are currently the 9th richest club in Europe
If they chose to half what they receive from match day revenue they fall to…still the 9th richest club in Europe. In fact they could let everyone in for free next season and still be 13th
So don’t give that propaganda bullshit. Its you living in a fantasy
Check here if you want to so the sums yourself
http://www.deloitte.com/view/en_GB/uk/industries/sportsbusinessgroup/sports/football/deloitte-football-money-league/5aa11261e7c5c310VgnVCM3000003456f70aRCRD.htm
Strange response.
Is it not obvious Doug’s point is that if FSG make x amount of tickets y% cheaper there will be some sort of material effect on the bottom line, in turn making it more difficult to improve the squad, in turn making it much more difficult to be a success on the pitch, in turn making it more difficult to be a success off the pitch?
He said if we reduced ticket prices we’d be playing in the championship. I disproved that likelihood with actual facts. So I find its your response which is actually the strange one
Jesus. John, he used hyperbole as a rhetorical device to make a point, i.e. you weren’t supposed to take his exaggeration serious, just the idea behind it. I thought that was crystal clear. Maybe not. I’d very much doubt he actually thinks we’d be relegated should FSG drop ticket prices.
But the point that he, and I, made (which you ignored in your response) is that if ticket prices were to drop then that compromises the business’ bottom line. In turn, this would therefore make it more difficult to improve the team/squad.
I agree with the idea of making certain tickets much more expensive so that we can lower the price on others. This would make revenue from tickets in the same. But what was discussed was lowering ticket pricing = lowering ticket revenue.
Nice one!!!
Karl,
1st up it is not a bad article as you have articulated your point of view very well.
Though it must be said many aspects of your article tended to be knitpicking points against FSG.
What also wasnt clear was your expectation as to where we should be or your expectation as to what should be done by now.
It is clear they havent done everything right but what they have done extremely well is manage expectations.
Things certainly seem better planned at the club. There isnt shooting from the hip “spade in the ground” (remember that), there isnt bickering and back bitting and we have progress on and off the pitch..
Truth be told for a long time we are actually at PEACE!!
PEACE which we havent had for a long time..long long time..
Chillout man give them a break!!!
*whispers* we play Real Madrid a week from today
Flying Dalglish over to Boston to sack him was poor and I think 90+% of the base would agree with that, but the manner of his sacking was my only issue with the whole thing.
The Dalglish thing was absolutely mad and I hate FSG for that. But gotta say most other things they’re doing or have done have been for the good of the club – or the business. Just wish the most important thing to the club (the fans) could be thought of a bit more. The cost of going the match nowadays is getting beyond the normal family, especially if you want to go regularly.
Sorry Karl but I think Everton are the club for you. Too much bitterness & small mindedness there mate.
Sorry, but Dalglish went a year too late. There is no way you can sack a legend without getting some stick, but they did reasonably well.
As for tickets, we can:
– stop asking for a bigger transfer kitty, and go back to Rafa’s wheeling ‘n’ dealing
– make a portion of people pay more to enable some people to pay less (i.e. tweak the current system)
– find a benevolent (read: foolhardy) billionaire
– convince the players to take a big pay cut
– put up with the status quo
I’ve not really got any sympathy for your predicament about how you view LFC over how you’d like to see them. I can assure you no one will ever invent a time machine. I’d like to suggest you follow a Conference team but that’s just stupid. People don’t change their team. So, you’re stuck with progress I’m afraid. I sometimes wish I could go back to the late 80’s. I remember those times so fondly. New exciting relationships, hitch hiking round the country watching bands, queuing up and paying 75p to stand on the Kop. Mushrooms midweek. I realised a long time ago though, I can’t do any of those things anymore. Times have changed and circumstances have changed. To avoid disappointment I found things I can do to replace the things I can’t. I do yoga, I spend all my spare time at my allotment. I irritate people online. People may read that and think I’m a bit odd but the key is, I really enjoy it. By accepting change and not dwelling on the past I’m actually very content. I think what I’m trying to say is I don’t torture myself. There’s nothing to gain from it. If I wanted to torture myself I’d have become an Opus Dei monk. You never hear anything about the Luddites now. They just disappeared into obscurity.
You mention those early days of FSG and how you realised you were enjoying the match again. Well, I’m pleased for you. For me, it didn’t come until later. I know exactly when it was. It was the Derby last season. It was for many reasons. It was a midweek game, for one, but my memory of that night was hugging all the blokes around me in a big group on the aisle. We don’t speak to each other aside from ‘alright’. Never have, and don’t again this season. We were so good from that day on though it was hard not to be enthusiastic. We were united in our ecstasy. They were brilliant times. You see, my problem is, it’s what happens on the pitch that concerns me. If Liverpool are good I can forgive a lot. If we go into decline on the pitch then I change. I can’t accept it.
Last season was down to Suarez, Rodgers, Sturridge, Sterling etc etc but it was also the coming to fruition of FSG’s plan from day 1. Last season wasn’t a total shock for me. I bought into FSG’s dream for the sake of harmony and unity and the truth is, I predicted last season in early 2011. What I heard them saying was wrong with LFC – I absolutely agreed with. I just thought it would need 3 or 4 years to sort out. Admittedly, the extent of our brilliance was a shock but I feel they pinpointed the major issues. They’ve made mistakes but then they’ve learned from them. I’m sure they’ll sell the club after around 10 years and make a tidy profit but they’ve insinuated from day one they’ll leave the club with the ability to be self sufficient. It may be for the eventual sales pitch but when that time comes we’ll be a successful team with higher revenues, a bigger ground capacity, a bigger brand and so ultimately – with better players. That’s how it’ll be.
This presence at the club thing. My team at work are dispersed all over the place. I’ve never met them. I know everything about them and their lives because Skype is brilliant. I speak to most of them daily. I do work with a few people face to face but when I want to communicate with them I email them rather than speak to them. It works fine. Will you be any happier when the new head office is within a bus journey from you? Personally, I don’t want to see FSG around Brendan Rodgers. I don’t want to hear about them wishing the players good luck before a match. I just want them to knuckle down, make some cash, however they please, providing it doesn’t humiliate the team or fans, and then go out and spend it on players. I don’t want it over complicated. There’s people in place now for every need.
So, it’s your choice to be pissed off with them and you’re clearly not alone judging by some of the comments. As I was saying earlier, it’s just a state of mind. It’s your choice. I’m happy that I’m happy with most aspects of Liverpool FC though. It feels good. You should try yoga mate.
God, articles like this make me bloody despair, they really do.
Get with it FFS – FSG are businessmen, not sentimentalists. I love King Kenny as much as any fan, but for god’s sake – GET OVER IT. Our performances were just poor, especially after so much investment had been made – Kenny was never a long term solution, he was a stop gap.
For the stabilising he ensured, I am very much grateful, but Rodgers was FSG’s first real choice. Us fans got it wrong by thinking Kenny was the answer. It’s a case of hearts ruling mind – Rodgers was the opposite.
And the whole business dealings with weird looking mascots and sponsorship with coffee businesses? Again, get with the times – if you want Liverpool to succeed at the very top, we need a top class business and sponsorship model. If not, then say goodbye to Liverpool as a major force. Ironically, the likes of Karl Coppack moan about FSG not backing us in the transfer window yet think we can do it without creating an illustrious brand.
It’s the nature of the game these days. Take your red-tinted spectacles off and look at this rationally. We have a young talented manager at the helm of the club where performances are lightyears ahead of Dalglish’s (Hodgson doesn’t even bear worth mentioning he was that shite) and is looking forward to build this club.
Stop looking into the past for answers for gods sake. That’s getting us nowhere. I know a lot of you sentimentalists are snide about even Rodgers – because he has no connection to the club. Well fine, put it that way, then Shankly had no right coming to this club. I can ensure that if Rodgers was an ex-player with tons of medals he would be given the benefit of the doubt. Because he isn’t, that gives sentimentalists license to attack the man.
FSG and Rodgers have taken the club to the next level with a sustainable business model and a young talented squad. No offence Karl but your the deluded sort who’d think that getting the old gang back together and out of retirement would propel us to years of dominance.
This is one issue I have with so many of the clubs fans – stop looking to the past to progress in the future. Liverpool make legends – we don’t rely on them. Rodgers has all the ingredients to become one, and FSG are the right bunch to own us. If you don’t want to accept ‘aliens’ into the club, then by all means continue your deluded fantasies based on the past and keep living in the past.
But if you really really really had the clubs interests at heart, you’d give FSG and Rodgers the chance to succeed. The fact we’ve seen progression, yet STILL fans like yourself Karl are keen to fling shit all over the place suggests you’re letting irrational emotions dominate rather than cool and calculated rationality. The former is a recipe for disaster, the latter is a method for success. There’s only one choice.
Well, I wasn’t going to reply to any comments on here but I’ve been misrepresented a bit.
First of all. I’m not a seething mass of bile who flagellates on an hourly basis about the owners. I’ve made my peace with them but can’t forgive the treatment of a good man. I’m not going to lie about that. I loved last seasojn. I’ve given Rodgers a chance (he’ll be glad to know) and although I thought his appointment was ridiculous at the time given his experience he’s clearly doing well.
The whole point about this article was how you can let prejudices colour your thinking and everyone who’s slated me here is just as guilty as I am. We’re defending standpoints that have been ingrained over time.
Finally, and I think this is relevant, I didn’t just wake up and think ‘Let’s slag FSG off’ in a fit of pique. I was asked to write my thoughts on their tenure and I’m not going to write P.R when I’m asked to do so. Some people seem (unusually) irritated by my views, which is fine – I can guarantee many TAW writers read it with a frown too – but I’m not going to lie for the sake of niceness. I can only be honest as to how I see things. That seems to have upset people.
As for me being bitter, grumpy, Everton etc., well, you don’t know me. You really don’t. I smiled only the other day. Well, nearly…
Anyway, it’s sparked a debate if nothing else so there’s always that. Ta everyone.
Karl. Like your previous articles it’s a well written, interesting and timely piece. I think this subject would always polarise the readers. There’s not much indifference in the FSG debate. Especially when Kenny’s at the centre of it. What I wanted to say though is, in some ways it’s nothing more than unfortunate timing. This season’s rapidly gone downhill from the expectations at the start and people have become twitchy. I feel it in myself and I see it in other people. To then come under attack from Roy Hodgson was just a piss take too far. Especially with the FA being his boss. You know how they get our backs up. So, this week, people are not only twitchy but have become angry as well. It can manifest itself in many ways. One of the most common ways is to go on the defensive. I’d class myself in this group but some people almost see themselves like a fascist police force rooting out the ones who don’t tow the official party line. I’ve noticed it a lot this last month but this week has been particularly bad. It just seems to be a natural reaction to adversity. It’s kind of in our collective psyche as Liverpool fans. I’m not gonna backtrack on my view that you need to try and put it behind you for your own benefit but I certainly think you can be pleased with this article and in a perverse way, even the comments. It’s engaged people enough to want to comment. So, keep up the good work. I look forward to reading your next one.
Karl, top marks for coming on here, responding to some of our criticisms and explaining your thought process.
Not that you’ll probably care, but by doing that you automatically gain more of my, and most likely others, respect. Fair play lad. If only more were like you, not just here, but across many journalistic platforms.
I do take issue though with you saying we, like you, have let prejudiced/ingrained thinking colour our judgement. No. We have seen the massive improvement in the team, in the squad and in results since Dalglish was sacked and Rodgers was appointed, and feel that on the back of this evidence and on the balance of probability, there is no way it would have been correct for FSG to have allowed Kenny more time and pertinently, more money.
We also look at other football clubs around the world for more evidence regarding ticket pricing and corporate sponsorship and not only understand FSG’s strategy in an effort to make LFC great again, but agree that it is a necessity in the modern game.
FSG have not got everything right. That is virtually an impossibility. But like everything and everyone, they must be judged on their overall performance and I’d say they get a good B+ from most of us. Given what went on in previous years from successive owners/executives, that is very welcome.
Of course this does not mean that we are not entitled to dissent. I actively encourage it in everything I do, even when I disagree with it (like here). This way more opinions are heard and considered and despite naysayers claiming it only promotes disunity, the reality is it keeps people honest and overall is for the greater good.
Think it’s difficult to grade FSG when considering PR/interaction with fanbase vs commercial revenue, stadium plans and that’s before we come on to the sublime-to-the ridiculous football strategy.
Even just looking at their first transfer window with nearly four years of hindsight – it’s just bizarre. The two ins are arguably both our worst and best signings ever. The Torres out felt dreadful at the time and now looks like the best sale any club has made.
“A few months later I was on the Kop with my mates, watching us sidle past a fairly poor Newcastle side, when it dawned on me that this was the first time in a long while that I was actively enjoying every aspect of the game.” Same here. I think the Carroll signing in the January snookered Dalglish and Comolli somewhat in the types of players they were looking at and the fees for those players, respectively. If the likes of Kuyt and Maxi who were flourising next to Suarez, were a touch younger and on smaller wages things might have turned out differently for Kenny.
Oh and if Carroll’s header goes in v Chelsea and we win the FA Cup, there’s no way on earth Kenny gets sacked, not after two trophies. If FSG and Ayre say different, they’re lying.
You’re right in that he doesn’t get sacked that year if we win the F.A. Cup. But let’s be frank: we finished 8th place, 17 points off of Champions League. We finished the second half 5-3-11, with wins over Everton and Chelsea practically the only thing worth holding on to. If, in 2012-13, we were going through the same dismal situation with Carroll, Downing, etc., scoring just a little more than a goal per game on average and losing as much as we won… what do you think would have happened to Kenny?
Dirk was out of steam at that point and Bellamy was on his way out as well, so no real options to back up Suarez. Half the midfield needed replacing – to include Downing, you had just arrived! In essence, Kenny would have needed FSG to basically write off roughly 60 million pounds in lost cause transfers and spend at least as much under the assumption that *this time* we’d get the transfer window right.
Don’t get me wrong. I was thrilled Kenny came back. I was gutted when he was fired. There’s nothing I wish more than for some alternate universe where Kenny forces Ferguson into retirement by breaking our title drought.
Here’s the thing, though. We give people grief all the time for operating on hindsight, but weren’t we all ignoring the writing on the wall? We loved Kenny – and still should – but what should we have been expecting from the man when he took over again in 2011? The legendary trophy-winning victories he gave us and Blackburn? Or the troubling decisions and subsequent results while at Newcastle and Celtic? There have been a lot of instances where the media talk about FSG making newcomer mistakes, but I wonder if the worst one they made wasn’t putting all their hopes and expectations on Kenny. I would love to have been a fly on the wall at that time, to see what conversations took place in regards to scouting, the proposed style of play, etc.
I think people expect too much from owners,as long as they bring in the correct manager and then back the manager in the transfer market that’s all I ask,end of
Karl another top article again, insightful and balanced despite your inherent dislike. I doubt you could like the King as much as I do, but maybe you come close, judging by the esteem displayed in many of your pieces. You know what though FSG got the sacking spot on, our love and affection would have given him at least another season, maybe two or three. Would that team have come good ? I seriously doubt it. Then there is the reaction of Kenny himself, if he had been shoddily treated as most of us thought he was, would he still be heavily involved with the club as he is now ? Given his past record I doubt he would, yet here he is working with FSG and BR to make us bigger, better stronger. If KK thinks FSG is the way to go then who are we to disagree.
Robin C love the change analogies and why we should embrace it, nice description of modern working life as well ! I am just going to look up my local yoga class, might beat playing all my Jam LP’s.
Haha, I find it hard to use Twitter because I can’t articulate my point in 140 sentences let alone 140 characters. I think the expression people use is ‘talkin shit’. Conversely, in the office I can’t be bothered talking at all. Like I said, I’d rather email them than talk to them. Possibly a reason why I take out my angst on here now and again. On that point, I’m loving The Anfield Wrap coming on these comments defending their corner. One gets the impression they’re sick and tired of all of us knobheads having free reign to write garbage comments and abusing their writers (although in fairness, yours are usually spot on). If I wrote a piece and got criticised there’d be 140 pages of retaliation. Exactly like on my FB status’s. I can feel myself starting to ramble on again here, which is why I’m taking a break from commenting for a bit. I wanna prove to myself that I’m sane haha. But, joking aside, yoga should be compulsory for all people. It’s best kept as a secret though or we’d have an even bigger pensions crisis. People would be living till they’re 120. P.s The Jam in my top 3 bands of all time.
The mistake FSG made with Kenny was giving him a 3 year contract. If they had given him a rolling contract until they worked out what they wanted to do long term then this could have been avoided. I love the King, always have, always will.
I agree/disagree with a lot of the article. As an LFC fan I have always thought (for right or wrong) that we are different and better than most clubs. Unfortunately, I believe that we are becoming like every other club, a money making machine for people that don’t care about football, let alone LFC. It might pain me to see Mighty Red acting like the “capitol city goofball” from the Simpsons for entertainment but I am not naïve enough to not think that we have to go through this to keep up with the rest.
What I would like to see from FSG/LFC is for us to be at the forefront of new innovations & ideas. Why can’t LFC be the first “Big Club” to adjust ticket prices to get more youth into the game. Big ticket (Dunkin Donuts, Guardia etc.) sponsorships are great. The club should be doing this but does it really affect the most important people…the fans? (please don’t say yes as it allows us to buy more players because we are not doing that and never will as it is not our business model).
I live in California having moved from Scotland. I feel more connected to the club now than I did when I was back there. , I am lucky that I can have so many connections to LFC both officially & Unofficially through the website, twitter etc but when I go to games (and pay a small fortune) I don’t only want the match experience I want the Liverpool experience. That’s what the club I selling so that’s what I want.
FSG – 6/10
Kenny – Unconditional love
@finnie1892
Good article Karl
I am with you most of the way especially about Kenny but more so I am disappointed that FSG have not done better on the business front. I expected them to be a lot more savvy and I expected them to have a lot more initiative on many fronts.
In marketing terms, I thought that selling 1000 tickets to kids for £10 with a full adult might be looked at because the marketing good will and feel good factor would be worth the lost revenue.
With Kenny they dug themselves a whole, either, they should have made him director of football from day one, not in the true sense but be a board member explaing to them football and Liverpool and for him to be their moral compass; or make him manager but appoint a young coach with a view of grooming them as a future manager, but to appoint Comolli and not give Kenny more coaches and general support was naive.
The transfer market: They are learning very slowly and don’t seem to know who to trust.
Finally, not having a man from Boston day in day out from day one. They had the Jackouski? guy in FSG at senior level and he was the big reds fan that sent John the first email, from a business point of view not exploiting that seems dumb.
They have not completly fucked up but I expected more and I expected them to do more for young fans and kids because the long term rewards outstrip any short gain losses.
Can i address everyone of your points there.
You thought they would be more business savvy. You then offer a business idea that loses money. I was gobsmacked and disappointed to read Karl’s point about the Indonesian flag maker. So it seems FSG don’t do goodwill. Personally, I would like to see cheaper tickets per se but let’s not kid ourselves that LFC need goodwill gestures from a business perspective (as in to increase revenue). Tesco/BT/Sky etc need goodwill to keep their customers from going elsewhere. There’s nowhere else to go for a football fan. I agree with your sentiment but not your logic.
Should have appointed Kenny as a director as a moral compass and got him to ‘groom’ a young boy as manager. Jesus mate, wrong on so many levels. I backed the T-shirts at that time. Still do really. Thousands didn’t though. It wasn’t seen as Kenny’s finest ‘moral’ hour elsewhere. Let’s say they take the young manager on under Kenny’s guidance and it’s going horribly wrong. Do you persevere for the future benefit? Is there a guarantee this young manager will be any good in 5 years? If they go for a higher calibre from the off. Who will accept being Kenny’s puppet. Only a weak man. Not what we need. Conclusion – We all want Kenny at the club in some capacity, probably as ambassador. We need that connection. But, the club can perform without him. Don’t forget that.
Not having a man in from Day 1. Ian Ayre said they all speak daily. As someone who works in the environment of Skype and multiple people looking at cloud based spreadsheets, I’m pretty convinced there’s no real benefit. I feel it’s a red herring and stick to beat them with. Hogan is starting here (well, London) full time in November. My mate has a bar. He’s an expert in the bar business. It’s owned by an investor though. He puts up the cash and leaves him to it. Poor analogy considering the difference in turn over but similar principles apply. It’s the chosen experts who run their departments. They then report to FSG. Nothing more needed IMO.
Transfer market – learning slowly and don’t know who to trust. I, and many others, were pleased with the transfer committee. Pleased with the principle and the personnel. What more can they do. They were let down initially and took steps to rectify it. Seems harsh. P.s We looked for a striker all summer. We just aimed too high (which was what we all wanted).
Karl has issues with them regarding their past behaviour. That’s fair enough. You can’t help how you feel emotionally. You’re basing your complaints on unjust criticism of the business model though. They could be doing a whole lot worse.
Star Wars? Deus Ex? No wonder you don’t trust FSG, suits or anyone paying their own bills. Good God man, outta the basement and in to the light with you. The airs fresher outside and some exercise might do your capacity for forward thought some good.
As my late grandmother used to say, Kenny Dalglish (nonpareil LFC God that he is) “…made a rod for his own behind…”. He was, at one point in time, a fabulous footballer and an excellent manager…at one point in time. He did not cover himself (or the club) in glory vis a vis the Suarez-Evra debacle. To find as much fault with John Henry/FSG as the author has managed to do indicates to me that is living in a fantasy world. The notion that an owner cannot simultaneously own a club “as a business”, and genuinely “care” about it as a fan is ludicrous. John Henry and FSG is/are the best thing that has happened to LFC in a long, long time.